I've always been of the understanding and personal belief that the 4.4 TDV8 / SDV8 is a very strong, reliable engine.

Yes, the 4.4 TDV8 has a couple of minor issues with oil cooler gasket failures, alternator failures and turbo drain mods being required - but nothing that would be classed as catastrophic, such as the well known TDV6 / SDV6 crank snapping issue so well promoted by that nice German couple on Youtube.

My previous (now sold) 2011 L322 4.4 TDV8 gave me impeccable service with no major issues whatsoever to 122K miles when I sold it. It never even had the oil cooler issue, the only engine issue was the aux belt tensioner became noisy (another well known minor irritation).

However, I've now seen at least three fairly recent posts on this forum discussing catastrophic engine failures affecting the 4.4 diesel V8 engine.

What is the collective wisdom of this forum as to the cause of these issues please? The only thing I can think of, would be related to premature engine wear (big ends, etc) from oil dilution caused by multiple incomplete Active DPF regens. So in effect, primarily affecting cars that have done frequent short journeys or are 'city cars'.

I'm on the lookout for a L405 4.4 TDV8 and interested to understand what is thought to be at the root of the 4.4 TD/SDV8 engine failures?

TIA,

Jon 1992 RR Classic 3.9 efi Vogue
===================
Both my fatties now gone...
Previous: 2011 L322 4.4 TDV8 Vogue SE /// 2002 L322 4.4 V8 HSE /// 2009 Discovery 3 2.7 TDV6 XS /// 2004 Defender 90 TD5 /// 1993 110 V8 Snatch Landrover /// 2005 Discovery 3 2.7 TDV6 SE (Aus) /// 1990 110 Isuzu 3.9 County (Aus) /// 1976 Series III Trayback (Aus)

Last edited by D3Jon on 27th Mar 2024 10:16am. Edited 1 time in total

Quite interesting that you say that. When I had some work done on mine here in France, the ex LR mechanic was saying how nice mine was and that it was the RR to have (because it’s a 4.2). I said I quite the 4.4 TDV8 too but he said he is having loads through his garage with engine failures!
I was in a rush so never thought to ask what was up with them, but he said he wouldn’t have one.
Surprised me me as I thought they were very robust.

This engine has been in use on L332 and L405 for 14 years now and has a very good reputation for not having a fundamental weakness like many of predecessors. Later owners of older cars may well not have kept up with servicing or on top of inspections due to costs so that will show in more problems. Oil dilution is a problem on any diesel with DPF's so I don't see why this engine should be any different. If you are a RR owner in France finding any mechanic with a good knowledge of these cars to properly maintain them is difficult so it's likley the effects of neglect is even greater there. Nothing 'shocking' to see IMO unless someone can point to a specific and common failure issue like the V6 crank or 3.6 Turbo/EGR. 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)

D3Jon, nothing specific to the engine, just poor/inadequate maintenance.

As the miles creep up, oil changes become ever more important. Every 7,000 miles seems the point forum members change the oil.

Too infrequently, especially short trips increase oil dilution and number of heat cycles the engine and oil have endured.

Oil cooler o-rings left too long without repair will reduce the oil level and coolant level, potentially causing premature wear.

Not fixing intake leaks will cause the engine to consistently overboost, increasing wear. Additionally, it is a guaranteed route to DPF problems.

Not replacing a failed EGT sensor will eventually show itself, as the car ECU instead uses a default value.

The only differences I've read between the 4.4 TDV8 and SDV8 that could make a difference are that the TDV8 had the turbo smoke screen (issue fixed on the SDV8) and there are instances of the HPFP failing on the SDV8 but not the TDV8.

The old adages of looking for a car with good history and evidence of regular oil changes apply. Personally, I'd also not look for one with too low miles, because this will be a massive tell-tale it's been used for lots of short trips. It can instead pay to save both the money on one with higher miles, as well as dependability. c,10,000 per year are the right ones to be looking at. E.g. if 2015, go for one around 90,000 miles or more. 2015 Range Rover Autobiography 4.4 SDV8

JayGee wrote:

This engine has been in use on L332 and L405 for 14 years now and has a very good reputation for not having a fundamental weakness like many of predecessors. Later owners of older cars may well not have kept up with servicing or on top of inspections due to costs so that will show in more problems. Oil dilution is a problem on any diesel with DPF's so I don't see why this engine should be any different. If you are a RR owner in France finding any mechanic with a good knowledge of these cars to properly maintain them is difficult so it's likley the effects of neglect is even greater there. Nothing 'shocking' to see IMO unless someone can point to a specific and common failure issue like the V6 crank or 3.6 Turbo/EGR.

I note the point, “Not replacing the EGT sensor “etc.
Six monthly or 6k miles MAX oil changes to keep the oil fuel contamination figure below 5 or 6 is the only sensible route to prolong engine life.
Mike. G reg 2.5VM Vogue Portofino red 1991- 1999
V reg 2.5td P38 Rioja red 1999- 2006
53 reg td6 Vogue Oslo blue 2006- 2015
11 reg 4.4 TdV8 Vogue SE. Baltic blue 2015- date.
https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/topic56162...tty+affair

JayGee wrote:

<SNIP> Nothing 'shocking' to see IMO unless someone can point to a specific and common failure issue like the V6 crank or 3.6 Turbo/EGR.

Have removed the word "Shocking" from the title! I've watched too many YouTube video's where they add words like that to the video clip title to grab attention!

Thanks for all the replies so far guys It confirms what I thought, that this engine is one of the best out there (and in no way shocking)!

It's just when you see Camtechcraig (who we all respect and know is very knowledgable) needing an engine for his missus's L405, then see posts about another 4.4 TDV8 lunching itself, and another with a snapped timing chain, it started to make me worry a tad!

I saw a lovely looking L405 AB on Autotrader, private sale in Central London - which put me off it altogether. This might be unfair, but I'm assuming the vehicle has done a lot of city stop/start driving and loads of idling. I might be totally wrong, and it was only used for long runs to a second home in the Cotswolds, but I just took it off my list of potential vehicles straight away!

Keep the posts coming please, I'm particularly interested to hear from people who've had a big problem with this engine and understand what the vehicle's previous driving cycle had been?

Cheers,

Jon 1992 RR Classic 3.9 efi Vogue
===================
Both my fatties now gone...
Previous: 2011 L322 4.4 TDV8 Vogue SE /// 2002 L322 4.4 V8 HSE /// 2009 Discovery 3 2.7 TDV6 XS /// 2004 Defender 90 TD5 /// 1993 110 V8 Snatch Landrover /// 2005 Discovery 3 2.7 TDV6 SE (Aus) /// 1990 110 Isuzu 3.9 County (Aus) /// 1976 Series III Trayback (Aus)

No scientific reason, just a hunch....

It "seems" to me that it's the slightly later 405's with addblue that fail

I've not heard of earlier 405's or 322's running bearings etc...

Just my 2p... I maybe well off...  Pete

__________________________________________________
2014 L405 Autobiography SDV8 4.4 Loire Blue Ebony interior
2011 L322 Vogue SE 4.4 TDV8 Baltic Blue. Parchment over Navy Interior. Sold
2012 L322 Autobiography 5.0 Supercharged Ipanema Sand, Jet Interior. Sold
2002 L322 Vogue 4.4 V8 Epson Green, Ivory over Aspen Interior (Fatty Offroader) Sold
-Click for Project Fatty off roader-

It agrees with what my local independent thinks, he talked me out of buying a 2019 4.4 because of the numbers failing and the difficulty getting spares.

Cheers
Mike. G reg 2.5VM Vogue Portofino red 1991- 1999
V reg 2.5td P38 Rioja red 1999- 2006
53 reg td6 Vogue Oslo blue 2006- 2015
11 reg 4.4 TdV8 Vogue SE. Baltic blue 2015- date.
https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/topic56162...tty+affair

I think an important consideration is what if it does fail, as LR can no longer supply short block or full engines, so it does somewhat limit you're options.

If you're lucky and it has a LR warranty and impeccable service history it's a buy back from LR, if not its a rebuild (as I did), recon engine or a secondhand unit, all of which are wallet draining. L405 SV Autobiography LWB SDV8, finished in Aston Martin China Grey by ETO division.

OK here's my 2 cents worth!

Without doubt its fuel dilution, I go by the service indicator in the Incontrol app and see immediately after a Regeneration has taken place (yes I am sad I monitor them ), I can see how much the miles to the next service has reduced. Lucky to get between 2k to 3k miles before I change the oil. I do usually, 3 or 4 changes a year. But I am rural and lots of short journeys so worst case. My average mileage to next Regeneration is around the 100 mile mark!

Imagine Joe Public who is adamant that it gets 1 service a year or at 16k miles (as advertised) and ignores the IC app or doesn't see/ignores the message on the dash. Not prepared to pay for more services and not prepared to do them himself either.

@Haylands you have a point! as the later models have slightly different DPF/Exhaust Architecture which contributes in failed Regens contributing more to increase fuel dilution.

To cap it all, JLR were so by customers claiming the service light was coming on prematurely they offered a software update to increase the 7% dilution limit which is high anyway to 10%!!!!
For me its a ticking bomb watch this space  2018 SE SDV8 4.4 Byron Blue

Mine was getting oil changes under 6k miles and well before reaching 7% dilution and it still went bang.

Interestingly when the engine was pulled apart it was showing just over 3% dilution via my IID tool, however an oil analysis report from Millers oils, showed true oil dilution at .58%. Had all injectors tested during the rebuild and all good, so never got to the bottom of why it failed. L405 SV Autobiography LWB SDV8, finished in Aston Martin China Grey by ETO division.

What part of the internals failed? 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)

Spun no.3 cylinder big end bearings, see here;-

https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/topic68615.html L405 SV Autobiography LWB SDV8, finished in Aston Martin China Grey by ETO division.

Wow - amazing rebuild job. What do you think was the primary cause of the spun bearing? 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)