Hello there,

Looking for a bit of inspiration or advice really please....

In November last year I took the biggest financial plunge of my life (outside houses). As a result of my old 3.6 TDV8 needing a potential stack on money spending on it, and given that it had reached 150k with me covering around 25k per year in my business, I decided to purchase a newer model.

I bought a 58k 2018 4.4 (the safe one!!) privately from I believe a very genuine gentleman, who had the car on extended warranty and serviced by the book at one LR dealer. In January the car was serviced (in my ownership) by my local LR dealer (will remain nameless, but fairly incompetent for the amount they charge). I digress, within a couple of days the service light came back, but as far as I can tell, due to LR's fairly useless information system, I had no idea what needed attention.

So back to the same dealership, they couldn't understand why, the technician confessed to them being a bit flakey, reset and sent me on my way. Week or so passes, same again, go back, again clueless, reset , carry on, few weeks later back again.

The only other thing that I felt changed in my ownership, is that is developed a noise, very difficult to describe, but noticeable most when cold, on idle, with increased revs noise disappears. probably best described as a bit of a groany noise. asked a few people including the technician at LR dealer, and everyone tells me I'm paranoid.

Forwards to Friday before last, after completing nearly 200 miles with my ifor williams loaded up with a tractor, coming down the slip road, I could detect a very noticeable noise, which, long story short is the nearside bank turbo - no smoke, just knackered bearing sound. now done about 71k

I have since taken to my local indy who I have given all the information that I have just typed here. They confirm that the nearside turbo is shot (Circa £4k to sort). They also say that the other one is slightly noisy (£7-8k Total). They then also say that there are some other noise (I guess the one I prescribed) but say they cannot identify that until they have sorted the turbos.

Whilst I understand to a point, I do feel that I am very much in their hands, and feel, rightly or wrongly they are being a little unnecessarily cagey. for example the broken turbo doesn't make any noise until it is running up, the other noise is at tick over. Is the other turbo really noisy? or is at an over zealous technician who thinks everything is worn out. I certainly hadn't been aware of any noises, bar the tick over noise prior to the turbo failure. why would both be failed, I struggle with that a bit.

I would really appreciate any thoughts or input, either way. I know its very difficult to prescribe on someone's written word. But if anyone has any suggestions or recommendations I would be most grateful. I really do not know what to do. The £4k turbo, I had got over, the second is eye watering, and as for some more problems, well I will have to draw the line, its a family car and a tool for my job, it needs to pay its way, not be a financial burden, costs of running I completely get, but this is inexcusable.

As you can imagine I am absolutely gutted, I am heavy user and I had really hoped that by buying a decent, sensible mileage car, I had a good amount of time and miles before any big bills!

sorry, its wordy, but I try to give all the information

Many thanks in advance
Very depressed range rover owner

High Pressure Fuel Pump (right hand bank looking at engine) are known to be grumble on tick over, seems to be a trait.

With regards to the turbo diagnosis, I'd get a second opinion as I'm not sure the diagnosis is correct and the pricing is ridiculous. Yes, the one turbo is dearer than the other, but not nearly double!

Are they maybe pricing the job as they don't want to do it ? L405 SV Autobiography LWB SDV8, finished in Aston Martin China Grey by ETO division.

Thank you RRS

My thoughts entirely. The other turbo being faulty just sounds a bit convenient. I had the same line of thought over the cost increase for the second turbo, and I quizzed him on that. He responded with “the turbo is £2700 plus the labour”. I am not well up enough in these ones to know how much extra labour is required to get to the second turbo, once you’ve done the first.

I know in the past when considering doing the 3.6, the turbos weren’t actually that expensive, it was the labour. This same place quoted £8k to do the turbos on the 3.6, whilst another, miles away quoted just over 4k. I appreciate these turbos will no doubt be unnecessarily complicated!

If I were doing the one turbo, I'd do it with the engine in situ, if doing both, I'd consider pulling the engine, neither are easy in situ, but the one isn't particularly worse than the other. Pulling the engine and they both become a simple bolt off and back on job.

I think he's trying to 'make hay while the sun shines'

I assume he's quoting for new LR turbos as opposed to LR remanufactured parts (which are new and carry the same warranty). L405 SV Autobiography LWB SDV8, finished in Aston Martin China Grey by ETO division.

Thanks again. And what are your thoughts on both turbos being “gone” or at least one on its way? Pretty unlucky no?

I don’t like to say it, but I do just wonder, sos that seed of doubt in the customers mind he’ll just open up his wallet.

I asked about the turbos. He said they were britpart. Which was my second shock. I assumed genuine at that price……. Ok maybe I live in the past a bit…

Trouble is technician looks at car, then he feeds back to the office bod who gives you the detail. Some independents are becoming more and more like main dealers in my opinion.

On the 3.6 the turbos operate in parallel mode, whereas on the SDV8 they are sequential so the primary turbo does the low rpm boost with the secondary unit operating from circa 3000rpm and upwards. I've never heard of both failing at the same time (the 4.4 SDV8 in not known for turbo issues, unlike the 3.6 TDV8). It's possible if you have bigger issues like oil starvation, but I'd expect other symptoms (like a seized engine or big ends knocking) before the turbos starting showing trouble.

The Britpart prices will be genuine items, its just maybe that they get a bigger discount from Britpart than a LR main dealer.

Retail prices are: -

Range Rover 2013 - 2022 ( L405) / Turbocharger (4.4l Dohc Ditc V8 Diesel)(rh Side - Primary)
LR038044 - Turbocharger £2,317.04 inc VAT

Range Rover 2013 - 2022 ( L405) / Turbocharger (4.4l Dohc Ditc V8 Diesel)(lh Side - Secondary)
LR044563 - Turbocharger £2,760.05 inc VAT.

I'd imagine that they've quoted you ex vat, so they're making 20% already on their prices, plus I'd epect they'll get at least 15% discount from Britpart or a MD, I get 15% from my local MD, just by asking!!

Catalogue is here: -

https://parts.jaguarlandroverclassic.com/p...and-rover/

They haven't made mention of the 'other sound', seems to me once your wallet is open, they intend to keep it that way. No way would I commit to 2 new turbos, without knowing the possible other issues as it may make it economically unviable, or at the very least you want to know a bottom line price to be fault free.

You need a Forum member like mikey

https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/member-mikey.html

who runs an honest indie workshop to tell you his take on it, but in my view, they're already thinking about a nice summer holiday on you! L405 SV Autobiography LWB SDV8, finished in Aston Martin China Grey by ETO division.

Thanks so much again for the reply.

Ok so turbo prices seem about in order I suppose. I understand these places cost a lot to run.

He mentioned about possible oil starvation, but how on earth would that occur? No pressure lights or warnings? The grumble noise that I spoke about has been there quite some time, so like you say if there was a more serious issue I think it would be absolutely toast by now. It all seems really weird. Obviously starvation is a potential issue as both you and he have mentioned it…… what do bloody do.

Before you go any further or agree to anything I'd inspect the oil filter. Quite simply, remove the filter and cut the top and bottom of the paper cartridge off, open out the pleated filter and inspect it for metal fragments. If you find fragments then there's a good chance there's serious damage lurking that has also damaged the turbos, which is likely to mean a full rebuild (been there, done that, see my post 'All I want for Christmas') If it's clean then that's good and your back to the known problem.

Did you have any signs of heavy smoking on acceleration prior to this as that would indicate worn turbo seals and that in turn would eat through your oil level?

I would have expected them to have done the filter investigation already as its a good indication of the engines health and take literally 2 minutes. L405 SV Autobiography LWB SDV8, finished in Aston Martin China Grey by ETO division.

Sorry for delay, was just the one turbo in the end. Anyway all repaired, did about 200 miles and then the engine went bang. What utter these cars are!

Oh man that sucks! Is the engine totalled? Is it related to the turbo issue that you had?  _______________________________________________

2019 4.4 V8 Diesel Range Rover Autobiography, Byron Blue

That is terrible news, I feel for you...  Pete
__________________________________________________
2014 L405 Autobiography SDV8 4.4 Loire Blue Ebony interior
2012 L322 Autobiography 5.0 Supercharged Ipanema Sand Sold
2011 L322 Vogue SE 4.4 TDV8 Baltic Blue. Sold
2002 L322 Vogue 4.4 V8 Epson Green (Fatty Offroader) Sold
-Click for Project Fatty off roader-

That's a bummer, what's the garages stance on it? Did you/they check the filter as if it's failed within a couple of hundred of miles then there must have been something very wrong with it after the turbo replacement.

I guess at a minimum it's going to be a short block to get it back up and running or if you've lost faith in it, then it's the best offer you can get on it as a non runner  L405 SV Autobiography LWB SDV8, finished in Aston Martin China Grey by ETO division.

I bought a 58k 2018 4.4 (the safe one!!) privately from I believe a very genuine gentleman, who had the car on extended warranty and serviced by the book at one LR dealer. In January the car was serviced (in my ownership) by my local LR dealer (will remain nameless, but fairly incompetent for the amount they charge). I digress, within a couple of days the service light came back, but as far as I can tell, due to LR's fairly useless information system, I had no idea what needed attention.

Sorry for your loss, I would be gutted.
I believe its just the start of many more failures to come though.

The average non tech owner will follow what JLR have written down in their advertising jargon.
They wont use the Incontrol app warnings and will miss or disregard the dash messages.

Interesting- Did the previous owner only service the car every year/16.5k miles as per book? or is there evidence of extra interim oil changes as well?
It's relatively low/average mileage and could suggest previous short journeys etc which contribute to fuel diluted in the oil.

Bearings need the oil wedge, even more so for Turbo's operating in the tens of thousands rpm, fuel dilution compromises this wedge.

Its a warning to all of us - Full JLR services by the book without interim oil changes maybe a warning sign to walk away! 2018 SE SDV8 4.4 Byron Blue