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saxrom



Member Since: 13 Dec 2008
Location: Grays Essex
Posts: 23

United Kingdom 2003 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Buckingham Blue
Lost 4th and 5th gear

Whilst towing my caravan from essex to oxford on friday i lost 4th and 5th gear .I tried to change gear manualy but to no avail the gear numbers came up on the dash but it did not change gear after the car had cooled for a couple of hours all seemed fine.
Untill the return journey today i only made about 20 miles before it happened again it was a recovery job home as to drive another 100 miles in 3rd gear would have done all sorts of damage.
On arriving home the car drives fine again anybody else had this prob as its a 4.4 i wouldnt of thought the caravan would make any difference but it seems to as with no van behind everything is ok.
The RAC man seemed to think the gearbox oil filter could be the problem any ideas.

Post #7339 20th Sep 2009 10:28pm
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dan_uk_1984



Member Since: 12 Nov 2008
Location: Bude, Cornwall
Posts: 4014

United Kingdom 2006 Range Rover Supercharged 4.2 SC V8 Tonga Green

I had the same whilst driving "enthusiastically" back from Wales with lots of manual shifting. Basically the gearbox overheated and it wouldn’t go over 3rd gear for about 10 minutes until it had cooled down.

I had the gearbox oil and filter changed within a week, because ATF fluid degrades massively if it overheats. It is a Sealed For Life unit, which actually means it won't fail until the life of the warranty is up, but go to a transmission specialist rather than any garage or dealer.

Do you tow in Sport mode? This is kinder to the gearbox as there is less slip from the TC, it is also better for the engine to rev higher than for it to labour on hills.

I would also have the cooling system flushed as the engine coolant passes over the trans radiator and it can silt up.

Extract from Manual:

Cooling Strategy
The purpose of the cooling strategy is to reduce engine and transmission temperatures during high load conditions, when towing a trailer for example. Under these conditions the engine and transmission may generate excessive heat.
When in any gear other than 5th or when in 5th gear at a speed of 38 mph (61 km/h), if the transmission fluid temperature increases to 124C (255F) or higher, the EAT ECU employs the cooling strategy. The strategy uses a specific shift and torque converter lock-up clutch map. This map allows torque converter clutch lock-up and gear shifts to operate outside of their normal operation. This will reduce the engine speed and/or slip in the torque converter, therefore reducing heat generated by the engine and the transmission.

The cooling strategy is cancelled when the transmission fluid temperature decreases to 120C (248F) or below.


Click image to enlarge
 

Post #7349 21st Sep 2009 2:26pm
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saxrom



Member Since: 13 Dec 2008
Location: Grays Essex
Posts: 23

United Kingdom 2003 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Buckingham Blue

Cheers for that Dan a friend of mine has a workshop and also the same car so it will be done this week he is also doing his as he was under the impression that the box was sealed for life just goes to show you learn something every day

Post #7352 21st Sep 2009 3:18pm
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speedymarktd6



Member Since: 20 Nov 2008
Location: Worcestershire
Posts: 727

United Kingdom 2010 Range Rover Vogue SE TDV8 Santorini Black

as dan says change the fluid and strainer and flush the coolent system thru , also check the brakes on your trailer / caravan are releasing properly Thumbs Up Thumbs Up onto no6 Range Rover

Everyone needs a hobby

Post #7365 21st Sep 2009 8:47pm
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dan_uk_1984



Member Since: 12 Nov 2008
Location: Bude, Cornwall
Posts: 4014

United Kingdom 2006 Range Rover Supercharged 4.2 SC V8 Tonga Green

speedymarktd6 wrote:
also check the brakes on your trailer / caravan are releasing properly


I drove 100 miles with the handbrake full on on my c'van, didnt even notice (although I did roll my eyes at the single figure mpg) untill I pulled into the service station and saw the smoke! Embarassed 

Post #7367 21st Sep 2009 11:05pm
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delsilencio



Member Since: 08 Apr 2009
Location: toulouse
Posts: 116

France 2004 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Adriatic Blue

flush gearbox, new filter, new oil and add this one:

http://www.lubegard.com/automotive/trans_atf_platinum.html

you will have a new car... XJC, RRV8, Series1 86 and 107% of real pleasure

Post #7410 25th Sep 2009 6:55pm
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dan_uk_1984



Member Since: 12 Nov 2008
Location: Bude, Cornwall
Posts: 4014

United Kingdom 2006 Range Rover Supercharged 4.2 SC V8 Tonga Green

delsilencio wrote:
flush gearbox, new filter, new oil and add this one:

http://www.lubegard.com/automotive/trans_atf_platinum.html

you will have a new car...


You will need a new car, or a new gearbox at least.

Never deviate from recommended fluids in a ZF Gearbox. 

Post #7411 25th Sep 2009 6:57pm
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delsilencio



Member Since: 08 Apr 2009
Location: toulouse
Posts: 116

France 2004 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Adriatic Blue

" You will need a new car, or a new gearbox at least.

Never deviate from recommended fluids in a ZF Gearbox "



Who said that? Land Rover? They also speak about liftime oil filling of gearbox.....

Had the same problem with overheating gearbox and running electronically managed into the emergency mode several times during my holiday in your Highlands.

Was at ZF Service in Dortmund ( http://www.zf-dortmund.de/ ) for a great service : cleaning, spoiling, renewing of some small springs and ball valves, rubberrings, gaskets, new filter pan refilling with new oil, electronically testing etc... and have had a long talk with the leading workshop engineer....

Sump, filter pan off and beginning to loosen the valve block


valve block off for cleaning servicing and electronic testing


Oil of ZF gearbox should be change every time between 80.000 and max. 120.000km because oil has an aging process.
Fresh oil is thin like water and transparent with light yellow colour, mine was (after 107.000km) still like water, a bit transparent but mostly brown olive coloured. And sediment in the sump like coffee ground.
This coffee ground is the dangerous thing for the gearbox because it will scratch/peel off the clutch linings....
Fortunately no deposits of grinding swarf.

Whole procedure takes from 10.30 am until 2.00pm, pure working hours 1,5h, rest was time for cooling down before refilling. Cost in total 300€.

I have a new car, very smooth working gearbox. You notice the gearchanging only by hearing the different rpm.

No problem to add Lubegard Platinum, but no need for me at this stage. I can do it, when having the next 50.000km on the clock.... XJC, RRV8, Series1 86 and 107% of real pleasure

Post #7808 17th Oct 2009 1:24pm
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