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Experience is the only genuine knowledge, but as time passes, I have forgotten more than I can remember
Volvo V70 P2 2006 2.4 Petrol 170bhp Estate SE
MG Midget Mk1 1962
Previous: L322 Range Rover TDV8 3.6 2008; L322 Range Rover TD6 3.0 2002; P38A Range Rover V8 1999
I would say thats a variable resistor type unit once all the gubbins are apart...
A remap is really the only way to go if you want real piece of mind knowing the fueling is right and not guessed at if you want the engine and gubbins to last the course
Is that from experience kingpleb ? What does the "variable resistor" do ?
As I understand it, the box only does what a remap does but "live" as opposed to "in the firmware" of the ECU?
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Experience is the only genuine knowledge, but as time passes, I have forgotten more than I can remember
Volvo V70 P2 2006 2.4 Petrol 170bhp Estate SE
MG Midget Mk1 1962
Previous: L322 Range Rover TDV8 3.6 2008; L322 Range Rover TD6 3.0 2002; P38A Range Rover V8 1999
A tuning box can never match a true remap. Tuning boxes fool the ECU and engine into operating different to what each other "thinks" - i.e. it's a box which modifies signals going both ways to trick them.
At its crudest, this is simply a resistor to lower the rail pressure signal to the ECU, so the ECU raises it as it doesn't match it's set point. Higher diesel pressure means more diesel injected per firing, but it takes NO account of the other engine parameters required to determine if this is a good idea or not.
but it takes NO account of the other engine parameters required to determine if this is a good idea or not
and there is the rub....
what other engine parameters are required?
why wouldn't it be a good idea? (to inject less/more fuel, etc) A remap does this too ?
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Experience is the only genuine knowledge, but as time passes, I have forgotten more than I can remember
Volvo V70 P2 2006 2.4 Petrol 170bhp Estate SE
MG Midget Mk1 1962
Previous: L322 Range Rover TDV8 3.6 2008; L322 Range Rover TD6 3.0 2002; P38A Range Rover V8 1999
Ie if the exhaust temps were getting high as the fuel was too lean(extremely common in pet told) the tuning box would likely not be able to correct for this.
Just increasing rail pressure as Martin has said will just stress the fuel pump, pressure rail and injectors out that bit more.
Also for forget that lovely gearbox BMW lumbered us all with
I would just fork out the extra for a proper remap as they spend a few hours if not more tailoring it to you and your car and making it right. And also a full health check before to make sure it's not a waste of your money
No rea lexperience of tuning boxes, just that when i was a BMW owner general consensus was they were a pretty 'crude' way of tuning a turbo'd car, where as a proper remap if fine tuned live to the vehicle?
In my old Ford days we would simply wind out the actuator so boost came on a lot sooner... crude and cheap
I'm serioualy considering a remap, am in Essex if anyone can recommend a decent mapper
I run a tuning box after i fitted i to my last turbo diesel (not a landrover) and was pleased with the results which were about a 3/4 mpg increase and a noticable increase in performance. However i find it makes the td6 quite noisy i probably get a few more mpg and it does seem to pick up quicker but cant say i am 100% pleased. As previous posts and after a bit of internet research all the tuning boxes do is up the pressure on the fuel rail so you effectively over fuel the engine some have other features but they all work the same way. There is a good guide on ebay of all places!
After extra mpg and smoother drive (better pick up) so a bit of both but mainly economy.
Looking at the Rapid Remap Pro box as well, now it seems a tuning box is not the way to go. (the RRP seems a better more flexible approach than the Bluefin, as at the very least Rapid look at your original map - or so they say, and you get a choice of economy / performance or both!)
It was just that the tuning box popped up as an ad on a page I viewed and seemed worth the once over.
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Experience is the only genuine knowledge, but as time passes, I have forgotten more than I can remember
Volvo V70 P2 2006 2.4 Petrol 170bhp Estate SE
MG Midget Mk1 1962
Previous: L322 Range Rover TDV8 3.6 2008; L322 Range Rover TD6 3.0 2002; P38A Range Rover V8 1999
A remap would also take into account turbo boost pressures, temperatures etc etc, just like the original map. In fact, it is the original "3d"map, but modified extensively.
As already mentioned, a tuning box fools the ECU to shove more fuel in..........but what about changing ignition timing to suit ? for eg, to get a better burn ?
(EDIT : I mean diesel injection timing..........)
A remap should take all that into account.
Obviously you get good and bad remaps, but I had my previous car, a Td5 remapped by Td5Alive at the time, now Alive Tuning, and had it for nearly 5 years. It was excellent remap work.
I visited JE Engineering a month or so ago, and am well pleased.
My car is quieter now, with the bonnet open, than it was before with the bonnet closed.......the whole thing runs better...........
Just my 2p..........
Last edited by mjdronfield on 18 Jun 2012 5:13pm. Edited 2 times in total
2011 Range Rover Vogue SE 4.4 TDV8
Previous cars :
2003 Range Rover Vogue TD6
1999 Discovery Td5 ES
1995 BMW M5 3.8 6 speed
1992 Range Rover 3.9 Efi Vogue
1992 BMW M5 3.8
1988 BMW 735i SE
1989 Ford Sierra XR4x4 2.9i
1981 Ford Fiesta Supersport
A remap does increase fuelling, but by altering the maps which are read as a result of looking at all these other parameters FIRST. A tuning box lets the ECU work out where it should be operating, and then just bungs some on top.
It was just that the tuning box popped up as an ad on a page I viewed and seemed worth the once over.
Check prices and compare, but strictly going by what I've read about him, I'd go with Pete Bell. The added advantage is that he takes your map and modifies it vs. the generic map supplied by rapidremap.
And to answer your question from above as to why a remap is better: in essence, a power remap adds fuel. So you can achieve the same through various methods - the most simple of which is adding a resistor to the wire from the coolant temp sensor so that the ECU always thinks the motor is colder than it is (=runs richer). This is more or less what a tuning box does - which is quite primitive. Properly done, a remap looks at all the same parameters as the DDE ECU - from throttle position to ambient air temp to air flow, etc.
A tuning box throws a bucket of extra fuel in, a generic map takes what should be the proper additional amount at the right time and injects it, and a custom map such as from Bell is exactly the amount of fuel needed for extra performance or better mileage.
