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Freddy Bear



Member Since: 10 Jan 2019
Location: London
Posts: 15

United Kingdom 
Engine choice

I have a 2014 4.4 and am changing to a new car.

But which engine to choose?

I have driven the PHEV and don't think it is for me.

The default is another 4.4. Head says the new SDV6; heart says the 5.0SC.

If you drive a 5.0SC could you let me know if you felt you made the right decision? And what sort of range do you get when the tank is full?

Any other thoughts on engine choice very welcome!

Cheers

Fred

Post #501086 10th Jan 2019 8:42am
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Chalky



Member Since: 10 Feb 2018
Location: Marshfield, Bath
Posts: 263

United Kingdom 

SDV6 All LR cars from 1984
2018 Vogue SE British Racing Green

Post #501100 10th Jan 2019 10:58am
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CS



Member Since: 14 Apr 2015
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 806

Scotland 2017 Range Rover Autobiography 5.0 SC V8 Corris Grey

I'm very happy with the 5.0SC, having come from a 322 TDV8. It's smooth and refined when you want to drive it gently, but with a feeling of latent power on hand if required. Most of my driving is out of town, I use higher rolling resistance tyres (Goodyear Duratrac 255/55R20) in winter and do a certain amount of off road and towing, average since March 18 is showing at 24.5mpg using almost exclusively Shell V Power. Range on that basis is 400 - 450 miles. As the speedo over-reads the real figure will be a bit worse. One is in filling stations a lot, and of course town work will be much worse. The diesel is much better for towing, I've seen 4mpg on 'current use' when towing a light trailer up a rough track, in high ratio. If you do lots of heavy towing the diesel is still the better choice, unless you have a lot of town use which would not be suited to the emission control equipment.

The SDV8 would have suited my driving well enough, but I was concerned at the greater complexity of two turbos and AdBlue, plus the health issues associated with diesel particulates and the chances of diesels being excluded from certain places/regulatory challenges. My impression is that the 5.0SC copes better with stop-start than does the diesel, but I have not driven that many diesels with it, and one can always switch it off. I've not regretted the change at all, indeed I would not want to go back to diesel. Only Range Rovers since 1988

Post #501104 10th Jan 2019 11:33am
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Freddy Bear



Member Since: 10 Jan 2019
Location: London
Posts: 15

United Kingdom 

Thanks Chalky - could you say a few words about why you recommend the SDV6?

And thanks CS, very helpful. I am impressed by the MPG and range you get. Both would work fine for me. I don't tow, and most of my driving is out of town.

My concerns with diesel mirror yours - plus I find the SDV8 can be wrong-footed exiting roundabouts, it has a certain gruffness and on short journeys the engine is cold for most of it - meaning the cabin is as well. Plus the diesel fuel tank size has been reduced from 105 litres in my 2014 model to 86 litres in the current cars. I would love to know why that is!

Post #501106 10th Jan 2019 11:42am
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Chalky



Member Since: 10 Feb 2018
Location: Marshfield, Bath
Posts: 263

United Kingdom 

Freddy

The SDV6 is a tried and tested engine across the LR range and having had Disco 4's with the same engine (and it performed brilliantly off road etc) I saw no reason to change to a bigger or sportier engine.

The real fuel consumption using the Road Trip Lite app is showing 28mpg (car showing 31)but 90% of my driving is country lanes, short journeys and off road shooting and fishing!

One of the reasons I stayed with the V6 was because, if diesels are to be fazed out, I just think the smaller ones will be more acceptable. Probably daft to think that but I really do not need a bigger engine. It has plenty of power, is quick and very smooth. All LR cars from 1984
2018 Vogue SE British Racing Green

Post #501108 10th Jan 2019 11:52am
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Freddy Bear



Member Since: 10 Jan 2019
Location: London
Posts: 15

United Kingdom 

Thanks Chalky, that is very helpful.

I drove the TDV6 when I chose my current car in 2015, and coming from a BMW 530D felt I would miss the 'shove'. But it seemed very civilised and so - having learned the TDV6 has been replaced by the SDV6 - am keen to try it again. The 0-60 times are now pretty close to the 4.4 V8, and being less expensive to buy and run is appealing.

All that said, when I drove the 5.0SC it made me laugh out loud!

Post #501110 10th Jan 2019 12:39pm
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Montys 4x4



Member Since: 23 Dec 2014
Location: Suffolk
Posts: 66

United Kingdom 2017 Range Rover Autobiography TDV6 Carpathian Grey

Hi, now the oil dilution issue and 4,500 miles oil service frequency has been sorted in the TDV6 3.0D by the software update last Oct/Nov I would again give the combination of Performance and fuel economy a thumbs up. I do not do town driving in my RR and sit at an average of 48 to 56 mph in todays commuting traffic and average mpg is always showing 40 to 41 mpg. the front end is a little lighter and the engine block is further back than the V8 D so handling in the bends is less ponderous biggest downside is that they fit smaller brakes discs to the TDV6 and its so noticeable if you've had a 4.4 D or something like a Porsche Cayenne. I just don't know why they do it, its nearly the same weight as the RR V8 diesel just about as quick to 60 but the designers think the TDV6 doesn't need to stop as quickly. My Bentley Conti GT has front discs nearly a size and a half bigger at the front. So yes it would be hard to justify another engine other than the TDV6 and if the latest FFRR now comes with the RRS SDV6 power hike then a no brainer.

Paul Journey started in a LR2B at 16 and has incl. just about every Land Rover, Disco, RRS and Range Rover Vehicle owned or driven, I even worked for the company when it was owned by BAe - It must be a madness!!! because to add to my 4.4 TDV8 Westminister In Baltic Blue I bought a second L322 as a commuter bus, TD6 2004 Vogue in Oslo Blue with cream leather now both gone replaced with what could turn out to be my biggest mistake. Carpathian Grey ivory interior 3.0 tdv6 Autobiog. 2017

Post #501116 10th Jan 2019 1:22pm
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Freddy Bear



Member Since: 10 Jan 2019
Location: London
Posts: 15

United Kingdom 

Thanks Paul.

I didn't realise that regarding the brake discs!

My wife's biggest complaint with my 4.4D is the stopping power being less good than in her BMW, so I am not sure I would want to reduce it. Crazy!

My concern with the V6 is losing the anti-roll that I believe is standard on the 4.4 and 5.0 but not available on the 3.0. How do you find the handling in that regard? Does it roll through the bends or is it OK?

Cheers

Fred

Post #501117 10th Jan 2019 1:27pm
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Chalky



Member Since: 10 Feb 2018
Location: Marshfield, Bath
Posts: 263

United Kingdom 

Paul

I'm surprised you say the brakes are poor. Mine are very strong, so much so that if I put my foot down too hard I'm nearly through the windscreen! I've found exactly the opposite to how you describe them.

I do think that the engine suits the 8 speed gearbox very well and is ultra smooth to drive. All LR cars from 1984
2018 Vogue SE British Racing Green

Post #501131 10th Jan 2019 4:16pm
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forever



Member Since: 06 Oct 2015
Location: Oxted
Posts: 214

United Kingdom 

I went one better and got the V6 Hybrid Very Happy , great car same power as the V8, plus uprated brakes over the standard V6

Post #501140 10th Jan 2019 6:20pm
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CS



Member Since: 14 Apr 2015
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 806

Scotland 2017 Range Rover Autobiography 5.0 SC V8 Corris Grey

On tank size, it was reduced when AdBlue started, my assumption therefore is that it is to make space (either literally or in weight terms) for the AdBlue tank and its contents. Only Range Rovers since 1988

Post #501144 10th Jan 2019 6:54pm
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Vogue



Member Since: 31 Jan 2008
Location: on the hill
Posts: 3231

United Kingdom 2017 Range Rover Vogue SE SDV8 Carpathian Grey

The V8 Diesel not only has better brakes but also has a better front suspension set up, if you enjoy spirited driving the difference is very noticeable.

The other difference with the V8 Diesel is also not just the 0-60 - that’s only around a 1 second difference - it’s the 60-90 and above where the massive difference is. The traffic light getaway is immaterial - where you notice the Torque difference is when you stomp your right foot in the outside lane and everything just gets left behind. L405 Vogue SE 4.4 V8 DIESEL ~ #16

Post #501155 10th Jan 2019 8:42pm
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CS



Member Since: 14 Apr 2015
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 806

Scotland 2017 Range Rover Autobiography 5.0 SC V8 Corris Grey

Every RR, whatever engine, is nice to drive when everything is working.

When the 405 first came out the dealer told me that the performance of the TDV6 was about the same as that of the 322 TDV8. It is perfectly adequate most of the time, especially when compared with earlier RRs. I'm generally content to stick the cruise control at the speed limit and let the car trundle along (hence my better mpg), but I am very impatient at being held up by slow traffic. The 322 TDV8 was OK for overtaking, but there were times when more power would have been helpful. The 4.4SDV8 405 impressed me as regards overtaking. I think the 5.0SC is better still, and I'd not want to restrict myself to TDV6 performance if I didn't have to. While wiser owners than me may rise above this, I'd also worry that if I bought a TDV6 I'd feel I could have done better and regret it. Who knows what restrictions are coming, I'd like to enjoy my driving as much as possible while I still can. Only Range Rovers since 1988

Post #501205 11th Jan 2019 11:55am
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vanquishspirit



Member Since: 10 Feb 2012
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 58

United Kingdom 

A very interesting thread as I am going through the same issue. I have owned my L405 SDV8 for just over 4 years now and want to change it. I feel strongly that the time is right to go back to petrol and I am trying to convince myself that a 5.0 S/C is the correct car for me. I do tow, but not so much as to be an issue which engine I use, other than I would not go down to a TDV6. I am going to ask my dealer if he can get a 5.0 S/C from JLR for me to trial. Looking at the current woes that JLR are experiencing, I think they will have to hasten the engine/model changes though. If diesel is the fuel of the devil, not everyone can stomach the consumption of big petrol engines. To be completely honest, the Range Rover market place only really expanded as much as it has after "proper" diesel engines were designed. I bought my first RR back in 1981 and back them most people would not go near a V8 Range Rover because of the fuel consumption. Land Rover are in big trouble unless they can offer their cars with a seriously efficient engine range, and PHEV is not it imho. 2006 S/C owned from new. Black, sand with black inserts. Shes a thirsty girl. ( now gone)

1972 Suffix A fully restored 2 door

1970, chassis number 26 the first of the press launch cars, Masai Red

2013 4.4SDV8 Autobiograpahy

Post #501237 11th Jan 2019 6:18pm
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nubbin



Member Since: 23 Jan 2012
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 161

United Kingdom 2019 Range Rover Vogue SE SDV8 Corris Grey

Diesel is no more the fuel of the devil today than petrol was when Gordon Brown changed the taxation system in favour of diesel. I think we are all getting caught up in the hysteria of particulate pollution from what are very clean cars, whilst millions of builders, farmers, taxi drivers etc, chug around in filthy older diesel vehicles without a hint of concern. It is with these older diesels that the problems lie, not the high efficiency modern diesel systems that comply with Euro 6 regulations, which are allowed into ultra-low emission zones - proof of their relative cleanliness.

To put it in context, it has been calculated that the 15 largest ships currently operating around the globe produce as much pollution as ALL of the world's 760 million cars!! That is mostly because the heavy fuel oil they use is very high in sulphur, but still, the piddly amounts excreted by cars pales by comparison.

The ideal solution would be fuel cell cars powered by hydrogen, but we're a way off that yet.

In the end, it comes down to personal choice and also budget constraints. If you factor in the extra up-front cost of buying the 5.0SC petrol (4.4 diesel basic price £88k vs £110k for the 5.0), petrol still comes out as an expensive choice, (£22,000 worth of diesel is 3912 gallons, or roughly 98000 miles at 25mpg, depending on fuel price). So bascially, if you choose a 4.4 diesel rather than a 5.0 petrol, you get all your fuel for free! Laughing

Real world mpg can be found here - https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/realmpg/land-...-2013-l405

It is not possible to fully recommend any particular car, as we are all individuals, we all have different driving styles, different journeys, different needs, different wallet sizes, and we buy a car based on our personal preference first, and sometimes add in fuel consumption as an additional decision-making factor. In a US survey, the most common deciding factors on buying a car were -
1 Reliability
2 Exterior design
3 Previous experience with a brand
4 Reviews
5 Ride and handling
6 Price
7 Safety record
8 Fuel economy
9 Quality of workmanship
10 4WD

So, buy the car with the engine you first thought of when you considered buying one - that will most likely make you the happiest. Those of us who have already made a purchase will always tell you that our choice is best! Rolling with laughter


Last edited by nubbin on 12th Jan 2019 11:07am. Edited 1 time in total

Post #501258 11th Jan 2019 11:51pm
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