Kot wrote:

So looking at the Canada Database

https://wwwapps.tc.gc.ca/Saf-Sec-Sur/7/VRD...rn=2022668

Interesting looking at the units effected its 987 is that just Canada or Worldwide?

“ It also says 2015 / 2016 /2017.”

No, it says 2014 / 2015 / 2016, please edit.

The very reason I purchased a MY2017 vehicle  “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” -where’s the fun in that?

Hi all

Here is my current state of email correspondence with JLR...I have not pasted any chase ups (of which there were two nor any rubbish holding emails from them).

Me: 15th Feb 2023
Good afternoon.

As the owner of an early L405 Autobiography I write to seek confirmation as to the current Jaguar Land Rover UK stance regarding the above subject.

As you aware a series of documented catastrophic failures have occurred due to a defective suspension component. You have sought to remedy the matter via recalls in a number of territories most recently Canada (Safety recall N759) however no such recall has been issued in the UK.

I would be grateful therefore if you could confirm to me please:

1. The exact VIN range where the defective components are known to have been fitted on UK Market vehicles and

2. Why no safety recall has been issued on affected vehicles in the UK.

I note your latest recall acknowledges the potential for a persons safety to be affected and therefore am concerned that I or my family may be at risk when using our Range Rover and why our safety is considered to be a lesser concern than in other territories.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Thank you.

Regards

Name address and VIN.[/u][/u]

JLR 5th June 2023

I would like to apologise for the delay in responding to you.

When looking on our system there are no re calls on this vehicle, I can see you mention there has been a safety re call in Canada for the suspension knuckle failure. But there are no re calls inn the UK for this vehicle for the same issue. If you are experiencing issues with this on the vehicle, I would advise you to take the vehicle to an approved Land Rover retailer for them to diagnose the fault.

I remain available to assist further with any questions you may have.


A most excellent piece of subject dodging. First class.

Anyway here is my latest wording in response. I'l update as and when. Merry Christmas...

Me: 6th June 2023
Thank you for your reply however I would politely suggest you have not addressed either of the points / requests made of yourselves. My original email is attached again.

I am fully aware that no recall has been issued in the UK. The question raised (point 2 of 2 in my email of 15th Feb) in was.. why not, given it has been deemed appropriate to do so in other territories?

I also need to confirm that you have not addressed point 1 in my email i.e.. The exact VIN range where the defective components are known to have been fitted on UK Market vehicles.

The issue I have referred to is a serious one and not one likely to disappear. Looking at the documented failures thus far it is only a matter of time before somebody dies as a direct result of this failure issue.

I would like to hope it does not take another three and a half months to get a reply and further hope more consideration is given to what is specifically being asked rather than a high level less than useful response.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Thank you in advance. 405 AB exec seats Baltic and Cirrus
93 RR Classic efi

Remember it's easier to get forgiveness than permission!

Gone in order:
4.4 TDV8 SE - gone to a good home
93 Classic hard dash Plymouth Blue
03 L322 Oslo Blue
2000 Disco TD5 ES Epsom Green
98 P38 Rioja Red
89 Classic Cairngorm Brown

I have spoken again with JLR local dealers and they are unaware of any problems, and although i said google this site because there is no recall they have said that i will always find something if go looking...........

Unbelievable it has not got me thinking the part that i had replaced last year (same steering knuckle left side) maybe defective too

They have said i can bring it into them for them to check it out at my cost and also cost of transporter to get it to them.

Pretty sure JLR are reading all these posts and seriously need to wake up and do something like said above me and my partner were very lucky to walk away, circumstances meant was not on the M1

All

I am the original poster of this issue and thought it may be useful to update everyone on the latest.

DVSA –

The government organisation has taken nearly three years from my original complaint to conclude that this is in fact a safety issue and that they are working with JLR to ‘Recall’ all affected vehicles. This appears to be a very slow and cumbersome process with JLR Dealers seeming unaware of the original issue or that a Recall is being organised.

Wording from a DVSA response;

Dear Mr Xxxx

I hope you are keeping well and thank you for raising this concern with us.

DVSA investigates safety defects within the terms of the Code of Practice on Vehicle Safety Defects (the Code), which has the support of the General Product Safety Regulations 2005 (as amended).

Please find attached a copy of the Consumer's Guide to Vehicle Safety Defects for your information and a link to the Code of Practice on Vehicle Safety Defects
at: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications...-practice.

The aim being to establish if the defect is a failure due to design and/or construction, which is likely to affect the safe operation of the product without prior warning to the user and may pose a significant risk to the driver, occupants and others. This defect will also be common to a number of products that have been sold for use in the United Kingdom. Typical examples of this could be 'a sudden loss of braking or steering'.
The concern which you have raised is the failure of the O/S suspension for your Range Rover
Vogue SE.

DVSA has investigated this and a number of similar reports of steering knuckle failure, concluding that failure of the steering knuckle is a safety concern as defined within the Code of Practice.

DVSA has therefore recommended that further action (recall) is taken by the manufacturer, and we continue to engage with them on this topic so that a suitable agreement can be reached, and a solution introduced.

Unfortunately, whilst this remains ongoing, I am unable to give you any further information, however, please be assured that DVSA are fully committed to reaching a satisfactory outcome.


NOTE: This recall gives justification for claims to be made against JLR for repairs to these components. JLR’s stance previously (in may case) was that ‘they were waiting for the outcome of the investigation before being able commit to compensation’.


JLR-

This appears to be a very broken and disorganised organisation when it comes to managing issues of this nature. Why?

Facts

o JLR Russia - Issued recalls around 2021 for certain VIN’s to have their knuckles replaced.
o JLR Canada - Appear to be issuing recalls for a known number of vehicles (presumably within the known VIN range)
o JLR Saudi - Are inspecting every vehicle when in their workshops and will fit new knuckles FOC if fractures are determined.
o VIN Range – There is a known VIN range for when the defective component was fitted.
o Component - The knuckle was ‘beefed up’ in 2016 according to an ex-factory worker (hence the stop point of the affected VIN’s)
o Chance of rogue items during vehicle manufacture - All FFRR are manufactured in one location and therefore control of the components manufacture, fitting, torque settings, calibration and advice to dealers is all under one roof and no potential for different approaches from different plants across the globe. This all sits with JLR UK.

Issue/Problem Management
You would assume that each Country does not work autonomously and that any recall, safety inspection, replacement on a large scale would need authorisation from Group. You would also assume that is a issue of this magnitude and potential risk to life had been identified in one or more Countries that a holistic approach across all Worldwide Dealerships would have been put in place.

In reality JLR in the UK have hidden behind the DVSA before admitting any kind of liability, even though someone must have known that other Countries were taking positive steps to eradicate the problem.

This all points to a hopeless approach to safety and recall issues on which you would trust the DVSA or other watchdog would take a very dim view on.


Help required-

I would encourage anyone that has suffered similar to report your issue to the DVSA via the following link. https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-recalls-and-fau...ety-defect

If you could also make me aware that would be useful. The DVSA will issue a unique reference number which I will need.

There are currently around 10 known ‘victims’ who have come forward via this post. We keep in touch via a WhatsApp group. Two more have joined this week!

We are all progressing compensation claims but are at different stages of the process but no-one (that we are aware of) has any success to date.

** Does anyone out there have a route to a success for making a claim with JLR? A contact, method, e-mail address, social media route would be most helpful.

Paul

thank you for the update Paul  ... - .- -.




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Brid91 wrote:

All

I am the original poster of this issue and thought it may be useful to update everyone on the latest.

DVSA –

The government organisation has taken nearly three years from my original complaint to conclude that this is in fact a safety issue and that they are working with JLR to ‘Recall’ all affected vehicles. This appears to be a very slow and cumbersome process with JLR Dealers seeming unaware of the original issue or that a Recall is being organised.

Wording from a DVSA response;

Dear Mr Xxxx

I hope you are keeping well and thank you for raising this concern with us.

DVSA investigates safety defects within the terms of the Code of Practice on Vehicle Safety Defects (the Code), which has the support of the General Product Safety Regulations 2005 (as amended).

Please find attached a copy of the Consumer's Guide to Vehicle Safety Defects for your information and a link to the Code of Practice on Vehicle Safety Defects
at: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications...-practice.

The aim being to establish if the defect is a failure due to design and/or construction, which is likely to affect the safe operation of the product without prior warning to the user and may pose a significant risk to the driver, occupants and others. This defect will also be common to a number of products that have been sold for use in the United Kingdom. Typical examples of this could be 'a sudden loss of braking or steering'.
The concern which you have raised is the failure of the O/S suspension for your Range Rover
Vogue SE.

DVSA has investigated this and a number of similar reports of steering knuckle failure, concluding that failure of the steering knuckle is a safety concern as defined within the Code of Practice.

DVSA has therefore recommended that further action (recall) is taken by the manufacturer, and we continue to engage with them on this topic so that a suitable agreement can be reached, and a solution introduced.

Unfortunately, whilst this remains ongoing, I am unable to give you any further information, however, please be assured that DVSA are fully committed to reaching a satisfactory outcome.


NOTE: This recall gives justification for claims to be made against JLR for repairs to these components. JLR’s stance previously (in may case) was that ‘they were waiting for the outcome of the investigation before being able commit to compensation’.


JLR-

This appears to be a very broken and disorganised organisation when it comes to managing issues of this nature. Why?

Facts

o JLR Russia - Issued recalls around 2021 for certain VIN’s to have their knuckles replaced.
o JLR Canada - Appear to be issuing recalls for a known number of vehicles (presumably within the known VIN range)
o JLR Saudi - Are inspecting every vehicle when in their workshops and will fit new knuckles FOC if fractures are determined.
o VIN Range – There is a known VIN range for when the defective component was fitted.
o Component - The knuckle was ‘beefed up’ in 2016 according to an ex-factory worker (hence the stop point of the affected VIN’s)
o Chance of rogue items during vehicle manufacture - All FFRR are manufactured in one location and therefore control of the components manufacture, fitting, torque settings, calibration and advice to dealers is all under one roof and no potential for different approaches from different plants across the globe. This all sits with JLR UK.

Issue/Problem Management
You would assume that each Country does not work autonomously and that any recall, safety inspection, replacement on a large scale would need authorisation from Group. You would also assume that is a issue of this magnitude and potential risk to life had been identified in one or more Countries that a holistic approach across all Worldwide Dealerships would have been put in place.

In reality JLR in the UK have hidden behind the DVSA before admitting any kind of liability, even though someone must have known that other Countries were taking positive steps to eradicate the problem.

This all points to a hopeless approach to safety and recall issues on which you would trust the DVSA or other watchdog would take a very dim view on.


Help required-

I would encourage anyone that has suffered similar to report your issue to the DVSA via the following link. https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-recalls-and-fau...ety-defect

If you could also make me aware that would be useful. The DVSA will issue a unique reference number which I will need.

There are currently around 10 known ‘victims’ who have come forward via this post. We keep in touch via a WhatsApp group. Two more have joined this week!

We are all progressing compensation claims but are at different stages of the process but no-one (that we are aware of) has any success to date.

** Does anyone out there have a route to a success for making a claim with JLR? A contact, method, e-mail address, social media route would be most helpful.

Paul

question, you say yours is a HSE...is it sport??? ... - .- -.




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No is isn't a sport, just ordinary big RR L405

so where did the designation HSE come from...

range rovers are either vogue, vogue se or autobiography... ... - .- -.




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Unnecessary quote removed

@Cotswoldsrchilly

Hi there. Sorry to hear about your bad luck but glas that no one was hurt. This really is getting out of control. Pls check the knuckle on other side and measure the distance of the opening with the bolt in place. It would be interesting to know what that failed one is and the still in intact one. There is a theory that it is down to overtightening of the bolt.
Thanks for email information. I will resend my claim too.
I also think that rather than waiting for them, small claim court could be considered. Not expensive and relative fast.
Regards
Steen

Tbh it’s my husbands car and I am helping him work out how to get the damage sorted etc, and I assumed HSE was the luxury spec (it’s got lots of toys it seems). My misunderstanding.

thats cleared that up..

it could have been a whole new ball game if the sport was also involved ... ... - .- -.




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Stan, could the effected vin numbers be put on the first post so they are easy to find, just a thought... Ta Pete

__________________________________________________
2014 L405 Autobiography SDV8 4.4 Loire Blue Ebony interior
2011 L322 Vogue SE 4.4 TDV8 Baltic Blue. Parchment over Navy Interior. Sold
2012 L322 Autobiography 5.0 Supercharged Ipanema Sand, Jet Interior. Sold
2002 L322 Vogue 4.4 V8 Epson Green, Ivory over Aspen Interior (Fatty Offroader) Sold
-Click for Project Fatty off roader-